No. 006 Podcast Interview Best Practices from a Guy Who Publishes 3 Per Week

The Transcript

Podcast Interview Best Practices from a Guy Who Publishes 3 Per Week

Jerod Morris: This is Rainmaker.FM, the digital marketing podcast network. It’s built on the Rainmaker Platform, which empowers you to build your own digital marketing and sales platform. Start your free 14-day trial at Rainmaker.FM/Platform.

You’re listening to The Showrunner, a podcast about podcasting that will teach you how to take your show from good to great. Ready?

What a couple of weeks this has been, Jon, huh? What with the pilot launch of the podcasting course and all. How you holding up?

Jon Nastor: I’m doing great. It’s been a lot of fun, and the show, Showrunner, is totally up there in the rankings.

Jerod Morris: It is.

Jon Nastor: It’s in the top 10 of marketing.

Jerod Morris: I know, which is exciting.

Jon Nastor: I love it.

Jerod Morris: And we had that moment, I guess it was about a week ago, where the main New and Noteworthy page, if you scrolled a little bit to the right, it was in there, too. Very exciting times. Of course, we thank you for listening and for your ratings and reviews because those certainly help.

As we intro this show, Jon, I wanted to ask you just about the course and the pilot launch. Has anything surprised you? Because, to me, obviously, we spend a lot of time on the lessons and putting all these things together and trying to provide extreme value, so I’m not surprised that people really seem to be taking to those and liking them.

But I have to say that the community that we set up, this members-only community, has kind of blown my mind with how much value is there with all the people who have signed up already, who are in there communicating, the enthusiasm, but also what they’re doing with it.

Putting their artwork in there to get each other’s recommendations and exchanging ideas. You can already see networking and collaboration happening. I didn’t really know what to expect from that part of the course, but I’m beginning to think it’s one of the most valuable elements of it — which is surprising to me.

Jon Nastor: It is. Almost instant feedback. I’ve seen, I think, three different artworks now, and it’s with variations. Instantly, by the time I get in there a couple of hours after, it seems there’s like 10 comments. It’s awesome. It’s just such a great community of people. There’s lots of technical stuff involved in podcasting, but that’s not the focus with this group.

It’s really the branding, finding your audience. That, to me, is the stuff that really separates you and a podcast that’s going to really get noticed from all the thousands of other podcasts that get launched out there. I’m really happy that it seems like we knew who we wanted in the course. It seems like we really, really attracted that exact right audience. It’s amazing. I love it.

How We Plan to Ensure That The Showrunner Podcasting Course Does Not Overshadow The Showrunner Podcast

Jerod Morris: Yeah. It definitely is. Obviously, we’ve been focusing a lot on the course, and we’ve been talking a lot about it now. But we definitely don’t want anybody who is just listening to The Showrunner as a podcast to feel left out or anything like that. Maybe that was just me. I guess I kind of feared getting so into the course and developing materials for the course that the podcast became a little bit of an afterthought. I just want everybody who listens to know that that’s definitely not going to be the case.

I think one way to guard against that, to make sure that all of the great stuff isn’t going into the course and that we don’t share it here is that, Jon, as you and I have done some of these lessons, we’ve recorded some interviews and come up with some really great stuff that we want to share with the people here on the podcast. On some of these upcoming episodes, we’re actually going to take clips of lessons that are inside of the course and bring them to you here. Some of that information is really good. It’s really relevant.

Obviously, we can’t bring you everything, simply because we don’t have time on a once-a-week podcast to bring everything that’s in the course. I do think that we can bring some snippets, some clips of some really, really valuable content we’ve created in the course and give you a taste of what’s in there. But also just give you some really valid information here as well.

That’s what we’re going to do today, which is with a clip of the lesson that we did, the interview on interviewing, where we went really meta. I interviewed you, and while doing the interview, hoped to demonstrate a good interview while interviewing you — who’s become a professional interviewer with Hack the Entrepreneur — on your theory behind interviewing.

Any quick thoughts, as you think back to that, before we play the listeners a clip from that interview on interviewing?

Jon Nastor: No. I like what you said about how the podcast itself — this show that you’re listening to — is not in any way going to become an afterthought. When we say clips of these interviews or teachings or lessons we’ve done in the course, these are going to be thorough. This is going to provide serious value. We’re not trying to just give you snippets and stop it right at the end when Jerod’s about to say something brilliant. That’s not what we’re going to do.

We’re going to give it to you. We can’t literally give you everything because there’s not enough time. This show — and the vision we have for this show going into the future — is to make it a legitimate, stand-alone show that really does teach people and talk about and really engage a whole other level of podcasting. It’s not just a vehicle to sell the course. It’s really not.

Jerod Morris: No.

Jon Nastor: I’m glad you clarified that because that’s something I was thinking about, too. I’m glad you brought that up because I do really want to emphasize that. By all means, if you think you’re never going to join the course, keep listening to the show if you’re into it. This is what the show is for. It’s not just a vehicle to sell courses.

Jerod Morris: Besides, we got to the end of that interview on interviewing, and we’re both like, “Man, I wish we could share this with the podcast listeners.” Well, we can.

Jon Nastor: Then we decided that we should actually do that.

Jerod Morris: Right. Why not? That’s what we’re going to do. What you will hear next is a clip from the interview on interviewing that I did with Jon. We’ll play that for you now.

The Single Most Important Thing That Jonny Does Do (as an Interviewer), That Other People Don’t Do, That Has Led to His Success with Hack the Entrepreneur

To start out, the first question I want to ask you, Jon, is can you tell us what it is that you do that maybe a lot of other people don’t do that has helped you to succeed as an interviewer?

Jon Nastor: Wow! This is meta. I think the one thing that I do that I cringe when other people don’t — actually, there’s two — but the first one that comes to mind is I let people think. A lot of other people, when there’s up to five seconds of dead space after asking a question and the person is thinking about a good answer, they cut in and try and elaborate on the question or do something else or help out. I don’t think that helps out.

I’ve actually had people I interviewed tell me after that they love that, because I ask a deep question or a real big question, and you have to give people a chance to think of the right answer. I do that in real life, too. I’m cool with dead space. It’s a good thing. Lots more, sometimes, is said in that blank space than in what’s being said.

I think that’s my thing. Also, I get my editor to leave that space there lots of times because I like it. I don’t like when things are snipped right up and everything’s too tight. It’s unnatural. I just don’t like conversations that way. I don’t think you can get truly deep enough sometimes. It’s hard. It’s hard for lots of people to allow that space to be there, but I think that’s the one thing I do. I’ve had feedback on that before.

Jerod Morris: Is that just a natural part of how you communicate and how you converse, or did you have kind of a Eureka moment during an interview where you did that, not maybe by accident, but just that happened — you realized there was a good result — or is that just how it’s always been for you?

Jon Nastor: That’s how it’s been since the beginning of this. At the beginning of Hack the Entrepreneur, I wasn’t quite as comfortable with it, but I knew I needed to do it because I want those questions. I don’t want just the same questions everybody asks. If I find myself getting into that sequence where I’m asking a question and the person just knocks off the answer like nothing because they’ve been asked it 50 times before, I don’t want that answer. Then I’ll really try, and I’ll even stop myself and try and, “OK, now I’m going to go off script and think of something else to take this conversation somewhere else where we’re both thinking.”

Even sometimes with my questions, I’ve taken six or seven seconds to be like, “OK, I’ve got to think of … to change this conversation,” because it’s becoming like too many other conversations this person has had. That doesn’t provide the value to my listener, so that’s kind of why I do it.

Jerod Morris: OK. One thing that we’ve really tried to do with The Showrunner podcast and course is provide step-by-step instructions, tutorials for people. One of the lessons in this module walks people through the email that you send to potential interviewees, the video that you send, and that’s a great lesson.

We don’t need to cover that here. What I’d like to do is pick up from that point when someone that you’re interviewing accepts your request for the interview. Walk me through that point from when the interview is accepted to the time when you hit record, that preparation process. What is that like for each interview?

What Jonny Does to Prep for His Interviews

Jon Nastor: That process now, it’s the same process, I guess, as it was all along except now I have an assistant. So I have an interview in two hours, and 45 minutes before that interview I will go and there’ll be, in Google Docs — she’s researched this person for me — their websites, their Wikipedia links, if they have one, their Twitter link, and then a general description about this person. So I know who the person is and what their business is like.

I don’t go super deep, though, because my questions really stay formatted. I’ll show you if you want really behind the scenes. Then I just fill out this form which I’ve made — which is my Hack the Entrepreneur interview sheet, which has name, guest info, the business name, books, any websites that they want. Then I have a spot for edits that are going through, links that they’re going to mention, resources during the show.

A Unique Strategy for Combatting the Lack of Connection We Can All Sometimes Feel When Conducting an Audio-Only Interview

Jon Nastor: I just go through before the interview, and I will look at the Google Doc. I’ll fill this stuff out. Then I’ll bring up their Twitter feed, and I’ll look at favorites, things that they’ve favorited, to kind of get into what is on their mind recently. Then I will bring up their websites, and I’ll bring up their Wikipedia page, if necessary, on my other monitor here.

I’ll keep it there the whole time I’m talking to them. Because we’re doing audio only, you don’t get to have that person. But if I have their picture there off their website, and I’ll find their best image. I like to have it there, so as she’s talking to me in my ears, I can see her. It kind of makes me engaged more in the conversation.

Jerod Morris: Oh, very interesting. I’d never thought about doing that. That’s one thing that I feel like you lose when you’re doing the Skype audio only. A lot of our podcasts we’ve done, it’s just been audio, so this is kind of new for us actually right now being able to see each other and converse. There’s a different level of interaction that you get from that, obviously. That’s a great tip about just seeing them makes it a little bit easier to talk to them.

OK. I want to go back to something you said, which is about your standardized list of questions. I have always been afraid of doing that simply because I fear the interview becoming like a lot of the other interviews that these people have done if I have a standardized set of questions. I wonder how have you settled on a set of questions that you feel allows you to extract unique value from people for your audience?

How Jonny Combines Set Questions with a Flexible Mindset to Direct the Conversation in the Best Direction (and Stay in Control)

Jon Nastor: That’s a good question. I have a set of questions, but I can only get to a quarter or a third of them in each one. It goes from my beginning two questions, which I usually try and get in there, and then I’ll say, “OK, now let’s move into work. Now let’s move into struggles and fears, or now let’s move into projects.”

Depending on how the conversation goes, some people I know it’s not going to be interesting for them to talk about their work day and their morning routine. I know that just from knowing about them enough and kind of getting the feel already in the first 10 minutes, so I’ll skip work. We’ll move on to failures and struggles. They’ve already talked about work a bit, so I don’t want to keep regurgitating it.

So I have a set of questions. I have a definite beginning and a definite ending, always. In between, I’ll play with it just with how the conversation is going and how I want it to go. It’s not just it’s always this, it’s always this, it’s always this. But I do, it’s right in front of me. It’s my document that just has the questions. I can jump around through it as I need to or as I feel the conversation should go, but I do always try and segue to like, “OK, now let’s move on to work,” or, “That takes us into projects. Now I want to know how you deal with projects.”

I just kind of feel what my listener is going to want from this person and from this conversation. If it’s going somewhere naturally and it’s good, then I’ll keep moving that way. If it’s not, then I will totally segue to completely something else.

That also brings me back into control. As an interviewer, if my first few questions go for 15 minutes, it’s like, “My show has to be 25 minutes. I can’t have this person go too long,” so I have to be like, “Let’s go to work.” Totally just stop that frame of mind and long questions. Let’s go to something else. It kind of brings you back in control, which you have to be as an interviewer.

Jerod Morris: Yeah. That’s an interesting question about control because, a lot of times, when people make themselves available for interviews, they have something to promote. They have a book, something like that, to promote. How do you try and make it an engaging discussion? It isn’t just focused on what they want to promote. Obviously, you want to get that in and talk about their book or whatever it is. How do you strike that balance during the interview?

Jonny’s Strategy for Keeping His Shows from Being Hijacked by Guest Pitches

Jon Nastor: I don’t allow people to just come on and promote stuff at this point. I get people who either agree to be interviewed by me and then their assistant sends, “OK, this is what we’re going to talk about,” and I send back, “Actually, no, we’re not. I just can’t do it.” Well, I do. I say, “You told me you listen to my show. That’s why you asked to be on. Obviously, you’ve never listened to my show because I don’t cover a specific topic. I cover the entrepreneur themselves.”

Jerod Morris: Have you lost interviews because of that, when you send back and said that?

Jon Nastor: Never.

Jerod Morris: No?

Jon Nastor: Never. “OK, yeah, we’ll do whatever you want.” I say, “Don’t worry. I frame this so that my audience is engaged by it. They’re going to learn a lot about you, the entrepreneur, and want to know more from you. At the end, I always give you the chance to do your pitch, always. That’s why you’re on the show. I get that. But we’re not here to just talk about whatever it is you’re into.”

I get emails literally every day — people, “We can talk about this and this and this and this.” It’s like, “You haven’t listened to my show. That’s not what we do. We talk about you. That’s why also I don’t have to send a whole bunch of questions to people in advance because it’s about you. Some of them might stump you, and that’s why I give you time then to think about it and figure it out on air. I think it works.”

You have to give them time to promote, always. Don’t forget that at the end. I always say, “We’ve talked a lot about you and your business in passing, but now specifically tell the audience where they can go find out about you.” I know that the only reason they’re on my show is to promote their stuff. That’s cool. We just have to promote it in my way and engage my audience in my way so that it’s more effective for them and their promotion at the end — and it works.

Jerod Morris: I was going to ask you, what do you send people to prepare? A lot of people will send Skype instructions and this very specific list. Other people are much more open. It’s like, “Hey, let’s just show up at this time.” Obviously, you don’t send questions, so what do you send to your guests to orient them, prepare them, before the actual day of the interview, if anything?

Jon Nastor: They get one email that just says, “It’s going to be a 30-minute, audio-only interview on Skype, and here is my Skype. Please add me.” That’s it.

Jerod Morris: That’s it?

Jon Nastor: In the email where I asked them, I showed the three questions, and I’ve told them about my show with links to my show. They can check it out. They’re excited at that point. People are busy. They’re already taking time out to do my show. I don’t also need to bombard them with a bunch of stuff they’re not going to read. I know because I go on shows and people send it to me, and it’s like, “Sorry, I’m already giving you a half hour of my time, but I’m not also going to give you another hour to figure out what it is you do.” We’re going on Skype. I get it. You know what I mean?

Jerod Morris: Yeah.

Jon Nastor: You’ve got to assume that your guests have a certain level of understanding about the process. Maybe if you’re in the dog market or a different market that they don’t, and that could be the case, but you have to kind of take that. I’m in the marketing market, and these people know how to promote themselves, especially via Skype. I’m all about simplicity. If they don’t need to know or they already know, I don’t need to tell them again.

Is Jerod a Dog Guy or a Cat Guy?

Jerod Morris: Did you just hear my dog walk in? Is that why you mentioned the dog market? Because he just walked in.

Jon Nastor: I might have. I felt it was a dog. I didn’t hear a dog, but I saw you look. Actually, I thought cat. I don’t know why I thought cat. You seem like more of a cat person.

Jerod Morris: I seem like a cat person?

Jon Nastor: I thought that would get you. I don’t know why. That’s funny.

Jerod Morris: I don’t know if I want to do this course with you anymore if you think I’m a cat person. It’s over. We’re done. That’s it.

Jon Nastor: I’m so not a cat person, so I find that funny.

Jerod Morris: OK, so I want to shift gears …

Listener Question: What Is the Best Way to Address Your Audience to Maximize Connection?

Jon Nastor: All right. Now, let’s get to today’s listener questions sponsored by The Showrunner Podcasting Course. The Showrunner Podcasting Course is your step-by-step guide for developing, launching, and running a remarkable show that builds an audience in the age of on-demand audio content.

For details on how to join the pilot launch of the course and get it for the best price it will ever be offered, go to Showrunner.FM and join The Showrunner email list.

Now, let’s get to the question via Ben Ramsden.

Jerod Morris: Yes, yes, via Ben Ramsden. This is a very interesting question. He’s basically asking how should you address your audience, and I agree with him. He says, “The podcasters seem confused about whether to use the first person or the third person, singular or plural.” The audience out there, you, listeners, fellow showrunners — he’s kind of asking how should we be addressing our audience members.

He says that the underlying issue is “an asymmetry in the depth and nature of the relationship between broadcaster and listener. The broadcaster is speaking to many, virtually none of whom they know, whereas the listener is hearing one voice with whom they often feel a strong sense of personal connection.”

Certainly, if we’re using podcasting to its full advantage, the listener is feeling this sense of personal connection. He says that “an old BBC broadcaster always spoke to his ‘dear listener,’ which was slightly quaint, but personal.” Ben says that he doesn’t like being lumped into a crowd of listeners. It makes him feel like he has limited value and one of the mindless masses like a field of sheep. He’s asking for our views.

I will say, Jon, that actually something that you said recently kind of changed my views on this a little bit — or at least made me view it a little bit differently. It’s one of the lessons inside the course, where you talk about the ‘audience of one’ and really understanding who that one person is that you’re trying to reach, that one person that you’re trying to speak to.

I do think that it creates a stronger sense of connection if you can use words like ‘you’ and ‘fellow showrunner’ instead of ‘fellow showrunners’ and really make the person who is listening feel like you are talking to them. You who are listening right now, if I can make you feel like I am really talking to you, that is going to be beneficial long term for the connection you’re trying to develop with an audience of many, but built on developing that audience of one.

It’s maybe a little bit of cognitive dissonance that you have to have there to say that you want to build this really large audience of many people by connecting with one person at a time. When you’re broadcasting, it’s not like you can call everybody by name.

To me, if you can do it naturally and it becomes organic — speaking like you are talking to one person — I really think in the long term, that’s going to benefit you. What do you think about it, Jon?

Jon Nastor: You probably know how I think. I start every single one of my episodes with, “My name is Jon Nastor, but you can call me Jonny.”

Jerod Morris: Yep.

Jon Nastor: That is, to me, the most personal thing. The amount of emails I get that are prefaced with, “Hey, Jon. I mean, I can call you Jonny, can’t I?” is amazing. That is the connection of the ‘audience of one.’ You have to always be speaking to one person.

I’ve actually toyed with it on my show of saying ‘many,’ ‘you out there,’ or ‘all of you,’ but I don’t think it’s right for podcasting. I’m not listening in a crowd. I’m aware that there’s thousands and thousands of other people that are going to listen to this show, but they’re not with me here. It’s me. I’m listening to this show. It’s the connection with Jon and the host that needs to be made in order for this to work properly. You have to know.

You say it’s like a cognitive dissonance, but I really think that it’s because you haven’t hammered down to who your audience of one is. If you don’t have the clear picture of this person’s name, where they live, what they do, how they think, what they’re scared of, what they want to aspire to, you can’t speak to them. You can’t speak to them as one person.

But I think that when you know that person so well that you can literally have a picture of somebody, if you want, of that person on your wall in front of you and a name and an age and everything, that you can speak to that person. If you’ve targeted it right, that is now your audience that makes up, obviously, a whole bunch of people that are like that, but you can speak to that person. That’s when this personal connection is made. That’s how audiences really do grow, not from saying, “Oh, to my 10,000 listeners out there,” when you have 10 listeners.

I think it’s weird, right? When you’re starting with 10 listeners, you should be talking personally to the person. I don’t think that there’s a point where you get to 10,000 listeners and now you switch over to, “OK, this isn’t personal anymore. Now it’s about all 10,000 of you.” You know what I mean? I think it always has to be about you, the listener. One person, always.

Jerod Morris: Is it weird that I don’t call you Jonny yet, that I still call you Jon?

Jon Nastor: Yeah. I’ve never told you that you could call me Jonny.

Jerod Morris: But I listened to your show before we — I was going to say, I listened to your show before we met. We still haven’t met yet, as we record this.

Jon Nastor: I’m only talking to that one person, though, and it’s not you.

Jerod Morris: Oh, OK.

Alright, so let’s move on now to our podcast recommendations. This is a new feature that we’re doing. We’re starting it this episode. We will be doing it for the foreseeable future, and it’s real simple.

Basically, I’m going to recommend a podcast or a specific episode — usually a specific episode — that I really like for a specific reason. We don’t want to be too general. We want to really make sure that we talk about the ‘why’ for why we like this episode.

You’ll do the same thing, and then we will put the links to these episodes in the show notes. It’s just a way to, again, kind of pay it forward, share some love to other podcasters out there who are doing things that we admire and also try and expose you, the listener, to other podcasts that are really doing good things. Both so you can learn from their content and from how they go about their podcasting business.

My recommendation for this week is Rough Draft. Rough Draft is a podcast by Demian Farnworth, who is also my co-host on The Lede. Rough Draft is another show on Rainmaker.FM. He had an episode recently called How the Perfect Article is Framed by White Space. What I loved about this episode –there were two elements.

Number one was Demian’s use of storytelling and imagery to illustrate his point. What he does, it’s brilliant. If you’ve read Demian’s writing, you know how good of a job he does with this as a writer. He really does a good job with taking advantage of the audio medium to do this in this episode. He also uses music really well to complement the imagery and to build the mood.

I highly recommend this episode. It’s short. It’s eight, nine minutes, something like that. In fact, all of Demian’s Rough Draft episodes are pretty short because he does a show Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday. He puts out four episodes a week, so I highly recommend that. Again, the link to that will be in the show notes for this episode. Jon, your podcast recommendation?

Jon Nastor: Did you hear that I was on Rough Draft last week?

Jerod Morris: You were on Rough Draft?

Jon Nastor: Apparently.

Jerod Morris: Oh. No, I’m a little bit behind on listening to all of the episodes.

Jon Nastor: I hadn’t heard it either, but Demian links to me and said the one where Jon’s on the show, and then I went and listened. It’s quite comical. I’ll have to find a link for it because he asks me a question that he’s never asked me in my life. Then Siri or something says my answer back, and it’s this computer female. It’s really hilarious.

Jerod Morris: Yeah, that’s awesome.

Jon Nastor: Demian’s awesome.

Jerod Morris: Demian is awesome.

Jon Nastor: Yeah. OK, sorry. To my recommendation, this is kind of off the wall maybe, but it’s called Mostly Harmless with Dammit Damian. It’s a punk-rock podcast. That’s what it’s called. I think he’s a great interviewer, and I’m really into it. I just loved seeing, he’s in a market that can’t have a huge, necessarily, potential for audience, but his audience loves him no matter how small it is. I really admire that about the show.

About 10 episodes ago in February, he had two interviews he kind of crammed together into one long, hour-and-a-half episode. He interviewed two separate of the Ramones, Marky Ramone and CJ. It’s just really cool. It’s really great. I like it because it’s out of the normal stuff that I usually listen to, which is compulsively listening to business and marketing podcasts. That’s my first recommendation: Mostly Harmless.

Jerod Morris: Did you say by Dammit Damian?

Jon Nastor: That’s his name. Yeah. It’s what he goes by. Damian Buford is his actual name, but he goes by Dammit Damian as a host.

Jerod Morris: OK.

Jon Nastor: Mostly Harmless. It’s words from … what’s the book? Oh, I can’t remember. Sorry.

Jerod Morris: We’ll link to it in the show notes. That’s like the magic elixir for anything in a podcast that you forget or if something happens, it slips your mind — “We’ll link to it in the show notes.” Just remember those words. It always gets you out of an awkward podcast situation.

Jon Nastor: There’s no such thing as an awkward podcast situation.

Jerod Morris: No. Not at all, but clearly, the first edition of podcast recommendations here was sponsored by the name Demian.

Jon Nastor: Yes, exactly.

Jerod Morris: So we appreciate that.

Jon Nastor: That worked well.

Jerod Morris: Well, Jon — Jonny, I’m sorry, if I can call you that — it’s been a pleasure doing another episode with you. To close out here, we do want to remind people, when this episode goes live, it’ll be May 6th. That means there are only a couple days left to join the pilot launch of The Showrunner Podcasting Course because it ends May 8th. We started the launch about a week and a half ago, and then it is coming to an end on May 8th.

What that means is that, once it’s done, we will not be admitting any new members until we launch it again this summer. When we launch it again this summer, it will be $495 for the course. Right now, if you sign up, you get it for $395. This is the lowest that the course will ever be offered for.

All you have to do to get involved is go to Showrunner.FM. You’ll see the form right there to join The Showrunner email list. Then once you join that, you’ll be immediately sent an auto-responder with the details about the course and how to get involved with the pilot program.

It’s not on Rainmaker.FM or anything. We’re not circulating this link far and wide. It is invite only, and to get your invite, you need to be on The Showrunner email list. The reason we do that is that if you decide not to sign up for the course right now, we still want a way to keep in contact with you and to let you know about new episodes, to let you know when the course is going to be launched again in the summer.

That allows us to stay in touch with you and continue to deliver you value — whether you’re in the course or not. We do hope you’ll consider joining the course. Get the information. Find out what’s in the course. If you join by May 8th, again, you’ll get the best price that it will ever be available at.

Alright, everybody, we hope to see you there. We will talk to you next week on another episode of The Showrunner.