As creative entrepreneurs, we have a tendency to get stuck in the learning process, and fail to push the needle by taking action.
Perpetuated by fear and criticism, the failure to launch a product can be crippling. We continually find ourselves spinning our wheels and getting stuck in a place that’s completely avoidable.
It’s a good thing we have pioneers and thought leaders in our space who speak encouraging words that help us take the leap of faith.
In this 32-minute episode Paul Jarvis and I discuss:
- What he enjoys doing more … designing or writing
- The Creative Class course that he offers
- Saying no to certain design projects
- Taking the consumption of knowledge to the next level
- Launch paralysis and how to get past it
- Being afraid of everything as a creative person
- How we use teasers to gauge the safety in shipping
- Responding to hate mail and other criticisms
Listen to No Sidebar below ...
The Show Notes
Paul Jarvis on Productivity and Growing Your Online Business
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Paul Jarvis: The problem with being a minimalist is the sound bounces off of everything because it’s just walls.
Brian Gardner: Hey, what’s up everyone? Welcome to the No Sidebar podcast. I am your host Brian Gardner, and I’m here to discuss the struggles around being and becoming a creative entrepreneur.
Together, we’ll identify what’s standing in the way of you building and growing your online business.
No Sidebar is brought to you by the Rainmaker Platform, a complete website solution for writers, designers, podcasters, and other online entrepreneurs. Find out more and take a free 14-day test drive at Rainmaker.FM/Platform.
Last week, I read and gave my thoughts on an article called “On Being Digital Hoarders” written by Paul Jarvis. Today, I have the privilege of talking to him and specifically about what he wrote.
By way of his own website copy, I’m going to let him introduce himself first.
“I’m Paul Jarvis. I create simple, meaningful things like bestselling books, courses, and websites for creatives and freelancers. I’ve had the pleasure of creating websites and digital marketing plans for Silicon Valley startups, pro sports athletes, Fortune 500 companies, bestselling authors, and the world’s biggest entrepreneurs.”
I’m pleased to welcome fellow designer, fellow writer, and not fellow course creator Paul Jarvis.
Paul, thank you so much for being on the show and for doing it so quickly.
Paul Jarvis: Hey, Brian. It’s my pleasure.
Brian Gardner: It’s funny, I’ve been following you for a long time, and this is how it is on the Internet, right? You follow people, you communicate with people back and forth, and once in a while, you get lucky — whether it’s on a show or in person at a conference — to meet the people who, hopefully, you inspire or, especially in this case, the people who inspire you. It’s definitely a pleasure to have you here.
Paul Jarvis: Thanks. It’s the ‘Mutual Appreciation Society.’
Brian Gardner: Before we get started with the article, give us a two-minute lowdown on who Paul Jarvis is in your mind.
Paul Jarvis: I’ve actually been struggling with this a lot lately because I’ve got a lot of balls in the air that I’m juggling. I’m having a hard time describing myself. So one, I design websites for clients. Two, I also have a podcast that I co-host with my friend Jason Zook. I also run a course for freelancers. I also write books, articles, mailing lists, and all of that.
I do a lot of things, but they all fall under the umbrella where I really like to help people and I like to feel valuable. Those are the five, six, seven maybe, ways that I’ve figured out how to do that. Specifically, right now, I just like working with freelancers because I feel like I’ve learned a bit in the almost 20 years that I have freelanced. I’m just trying to pass that information along.
I don’t know what I do, Brian. I have a really hard time with that.
Brian Gardner: You’re an artist. You’re creative, so it’s kind of ambiguous, right? We don’t actually know what we do. We just kind of do our thing and hope it helps others or helps inspire others or whatever.
What He Enjoys Doing More … Designing or Writing
Brian Gardner: I think, first and foremost, you’re a designer and a writer — at least those are the two mediums that I know you as. Which of those two do you enjoy doing best, and then I’m going to follow up and ask you — because for me this is a different answer — which of those two do you think you’re better at?
Paul Jarvis: I like both. I get asked this a lot because a lot of people nowadays in our circle, you work on client work — which is, for me, web designing — until you have a breakout product. Then you can drop all of the working with clients and go focus on that product.
But, for me, I like working with clients. I actually like doing web design for other people, so I don’t think I would ever cut that out. The writing for me is more of the one to many. I’ve made products. I’ve done bestselling books and courses and all of that. I love doing those things, but I also like doing the web design stuff.
I sort of split my time 50/50 right now with some design stuff, some writing products, and some writing articles and that sort of thing. As far as what I like better, I think it’s a toss up. I don’t know. Today, I like writing better. Tomorrow, it’s possibly going to be client stuff.
I find that the more I oscillate back and forth — so a few months I’ll be doing client work, a few months I’ll be doing writing and products and that — the more I miss the thing that I’m not doing. Then I need to go back to it. The pendulum swings, and then I start doing something else. Then I miss the thing that I’m not doing anymore.
Brian Gardner: For me, it’s the same thing. Back when I first got started on the Internet, I was doing freelance design via WordPress themes for people. The whole story of where Revolution and Studio Press and all of that got started was rejected freelance design that was, in turn, turned into a product — which then ultimately took me out of doing freelance work because the product was selling so much.
Years down the road, it got to a point where, as much as I loved doing product design and themes, I also missed that interaction and just having the one-off, trying to solve one specific problem with a client.
I’ve done things like Joshua Becker’s “Becoming Minimalist” site. That was a freelance project that I just did for him. I said, “Look dude, no payment. All I want to do is just solve the problem I think you have.” He was totally open to it, and it felt good to go back to that grassroots feel of working with a client in a freelance environment. So I totally hear what you’re saying there.
Paul Jarvis: Yeah, you did Courtney’s site as well I think in the last few months.
Brian Gardner: Yeah. Thankfully, she’s, first of all, very meticulous and very organized, so it was easy to work with her.
Paul Jarvis: Nice.
Brian Gardner: She just, like Joshua said, “Hey, I’m a minimalist. Got to keep it simple” — which, of course, as you know, sometimes is harder to do because there’s such a focus on just the design or lack thereof. It’s all about the couple of choices that you make. Both Joshua and Courtney were awesome to work with.
The Creative Class Course That He Offers
Brian Gardner: So in addition to designing websites and writing your weekly newsletter, you also have a course called “The Creative Class.” Currently, you have over 800 students there. How’s that going for you?
Paul Jarvis: It’s amazing. I didn’t realize how interesting teaching would be. I didn’t realize how much I learn as the instructor. I’ve been freelancing for basically forever, almost 20 years, so I worked for myself for a very, very long time. I’m like, “OK Paul, you know some stuff. It’s probably right.” Then I validated it, and I talked to other people. I did some research and stuff, and then I started a course.
It taught me how much I don’t know and how much I still need to learn. It’s so interesting to engage with students. I actually like this, and this is why. I started out writing books, and the books sell really well. I figured, “Hmm, I think I want to try this audience interaction, engagement thing,” so I was’ like, “OK, let’s start a course.” That was kind of night and day for me.
I found that it’s so much more interesting to be able to see how people are taking the content and using it as opposed to just, “I write a book. I sell a book. Amazon sends me the number of sales every month,” and that’s pretty much it. I may get an email or two out of every couple thousand people that buy it.
Whereas, with the course, it’s interactivity with the students all the time. It helps me create new content, refine the content I have, figure out better ways to onboard new students, and that sort of thing. It’s opened up this whole can of worms for learning for me — which I’m really, really enjoying.
Brian Gardner: I think humble teachers are by far the best kind. You get people who think they know everything. They call themselves ninjas and whatever, and they say, “I know everything. Here’s my stuff. Buy it, and I’m higher than you.”
What you just said — how you learn as being a teacher — and the ability to be humble in that regard and realize you don’t know everything. Maybe there’s times where the students will teach you something, and that’s a great symbiotic relationship.
Paul Jarvis: Yeah, it definitely is. That’s kind of how I approach everything, though. I’m not a thought leader or a ninja. In all of my writing, I’m exploring topics. It’s not just like, “This is Paul’s way. Throw down the hammer.” That’s where I like to exist on the Internet is, “I’m learning, too. Here’s some stuff I’ve learned,” but I don’t know. “It’s all learning. So articulate there.
Brian Gardner: You’re a designer. You have a course. You’ve also written four bestselling books that are available on Amazon. Quite the creative renaissance man you are. I’ve thought about doing a course thing, but I don’t even know what I would write about. Maybe I have a lack of, I don’t even know what the word is, but I arguably created the premium WordPress theme space. People have asked me to write about that whole process. At this point, it’s almost been so long ago that I don’t even know that I’d have anything interesting to tell them anyhow.
Paul Jarvis: You do have a platform for courses.
Brian Gardner: See that’s the thing. I personally have a platform, but I’m still part of Copyblogger. So any energy I put forth in that regard would have to be through the company — which is something I’m completely OK with. Maybe I’m just saving it for later. I don’t know. There’s plenty of other smarter, better course-writing people in our company that I’m just going to stick to podcasting and design for now.
Saying No to Certain Design Projects
Brian Gardner: Speaking of being a renaissance man, you have a design portfolio that would make a lot of creatives like me envious — clients such as Dave Ursillo, Danielle LaPorte, Marie Forleo. Just this morning, we responded to each other back and forth on Twitter about another one you had launched for a client. I got to tell you, much like Bill Kenney over at Focus Lab, you’re one of those guys who … I love you and I hate you because when I see the work you put out I’m like, “I wish I could do that,” or “I wish I did do that.”
Paul Jarvis: I feel the same about so many other designers — even when I look at your site, dude. It’s like, “I wish I could convince my clients to do that little in such a smart way.” It’s mutual.
Brian Gardner: Thank you. As minimalist designers, sometimes I think designers over design. There are clients who need so much on their sites, and they want so much. It’s really hard for me to want to take that type of person on as a client — which, of course, is why Joshua and Courtney were so easy to work with because they’re like-minded, minimalist. They have a few things, and the focus is on one or two things — Joshua selling books, Courtney either to be hired or her courses and whatnot.
I stay away from those who have a lot of stuff going on because I don’t know that I could adequately solve their problem in a way that they would be happy with. That’s a tough thing.
Paul Jarvis: That’s what I wrote about last week, about saying no. I say no to most projects that come my way just because I feel the same. I feel like if I can’t adequately get you to your goal as a client, then it’s not worth you spending the money on me.
I’m pretty focused and determined in terms of, “Do I want to work with this client or not?” A lot of times it comes down to, “I’m not the best fit for you for whatever reason.” I think there’s probably six or seven reasons that I wrote about. I can’t remember what they are. I think it comes down to it’s OK to be picky with clients.
Brian Gardner: I agree with that. Definitely, you don’t want to take on the wrong client — for their sake and for your own sake.
Paul Jarvis: Yeah, your portfolio is a reflection of the future work you’re going to get hired to do because people look at your portfolio and say, “I want that.” If your portfolio is full of stuff you don’t want to do, then you’re in trouble because you’re just going to keep getting hired to do more of that stuff.
Brian Gardner: On your website, you even mentioned that a lot of your design projects, or if all of them, come from referrals. In that case, your portfolio definitely matters.
Taking the Consumption of Knowledge to the Next Level
Brian Gardner: Let’s talk about the article because that’s really what I wanted to discuss — as much as I love small talking with like-minded creatives. The article is called “On Being Digital Hoarders,” and I like to consider these types of things that I read ‘”rants.'”
Would you consider what you wrote a rant or was it just something that you wanted to say? You see the difference there?
Paul Jarvis: Yeah. A lot of what I write is ‘a rant, but then, it’s also a call to arms. From my end, it’s a rant, but from my audience’s end, I hope it’s a call to arms. Most of the time, with this specifically and with almost everything I write, it’s to think, “Does this resonate with you? Does this seem like something you’re unconsciously doing that you can now consciously be aware of?” I think that falls under that. Where on my end, it’s just me getting something off my chest. Let’s be honest — it’s me ranting.
Then on the audience’s side, it’s, “This is Paul’s rant, but what can I do with this?” I’m very specific about the way that I put information across on the Internet. It can’t just be rant Paul, ranting for the sake of ranting. I have Twitter for that, and that’s pretty much what I use Twitter for.
For my articles, ranting isn’t enough. What can somebody take from that rant and use or apply or resonate with or act on — which is probably the main one, also the hardest one to get people to actually do. That’s really what this falls under.
Brian Gardner: One of the things I’m passionate about is authenticity. One problem I have is this — I spend so much time talking about it and not necessarily enough of my time doing it. After reading your article, it made me feel the same way. Where people spend so much time trying to research how to be productive or how to not be inefficient, but they have a hard time succeeding and actually accomplishing that goal.
Is that off base? I guess what I’m asking is, am I just doing these things? Or am I doing them just to say that I’m doing them, but not really doing them?
Paul Jarvis: Yeah. There’s a fine line. If you want to get into shape, maybe you do some research, but the more that you’re researching, you’re not getting in shape. You’re sitting on your butt staring at a computer screen. At some point, there needs to be actual physical exertion. You need to go to the gym, pick up that kettle bell, or something like that.
It needs to be a balance of, obviously, we all need to learn things. We need to learn things all the time. The minute we stop being curious, we’re basically dead because you need to be curious. On the flip side of that, you need to actually take the information and do something about it. Basically draw a line in the sand like, “OK, I know enough. I can get started on something or I can stop the research and start acting on the research.”
That’s something that’s personal for everybody in every situation, but I think that needs to be questioned a bit. Like, “Is this enough and can I move on to actually implementing things or actually doing things?”
Brian Gardner: Piggybacking that, another great quote from the article is this:
“Think about it, if you’re focused on learning about productivity, you’re not technically being productive at all because you’re spending all of your time learning about productivity instead of working.”
I love the analogy to fitness because fitness in the head is different than fitness in your body. I could know what I should or shouldn’t eat or what I should and shouldn’t do physically, but if I’m not doing that, I’m still the fat guy with knowledge. You know what I mean?
Paul Jarvis: Yeah, exactly.
Launch Paralysis and How to Get Past It
Brian Gardner: Here’s a question that I have in regards to the article. Was there anything specifically that you read or anything that happened that made you just drop what you were doing to write it? Was there a Jerry Maguire moment where you said, “I have to write this now,” kind of in a manifesto way? Or was it just kind of an accumulation of, “OK, this is enough”, and “it’s time to just write out what I think”?”
Paul Jarvis: Pretty much every article I write starts with a specific, and then I abstract it into a universal. For this, it was many specifics. Sometimes the articles I need to write just keep hitting me across the back of the head until I write them. For this one, because I’ve moved into the course creation side of things, I keep getting asked by people how to make them, how to build them.
I work with a few people — I guess it’s like friend consulting, like these are people I consider friends — and we just hop on the phone and talk out what we’re working on. A couple of them are working on their own courses. And they just keep stalling for whatever reason. They can’t launch. They’re in basically launch paralysis because they keep thinking, “I just need to redesign the lesson page for the hundredth time, I just need to add another five lessons to the course, or something. I just need to learn a little bit more and do a bit more research and put it into the course, and then the course will be ready to launch.”
I just started to think, “Why is this happening? What’s going on with this?” It’s hard because I want these people to launch, and I feel like this is pretty universal. That’s why I wrote the article. It seems pretty universal where people get stuck in the learning side of things and don’t move on to the acting side of things.
Whereas, with me, I launch things mostly when I feel like they’re not ready. The site isn’t 100 percent designed, but it’s good enough to put out there. A product is pretty much there, but not 100 percent — but I can always change it later.
Even with my own course, I started out with the idea to have 30 lessons. That’s a lot of lessons. It would have taken me two years to do that, so I scaled it back to seven. Then I launched. Then I’ve been tweaking and researching as I go and adding more lessons, adding more value, and adding more stuff to the course.
That’s really where the impetus to write this came from. How do we know when we’ve learned enough to move forward on something? I don’t have the answer to that. That’s just where the article stemmed from. Yeah, that’s pretty much why I wrote it.
Brian Gardner: As creatives, entrepreneurs, whatever, I think we have a tendency to have stage fright or maybe it’s a lack of confidence. It feels safe to stay within this regurgitation of consumption on productivity. “Oh, yeah, I’m going to be productive, and I’m going to go do this.” As I said earlier with authenticity, I spend so much time living within that, that I wasn’t actually doing anything that was authentic. I was just talking about authenticity.
In the podcast here, in the first handful of episodes, I felt like that was where it was going, and I was thinking to myself, “Now it’s time to actually add value rather than just spin my wheels and talk about it, and actually go do it without even talking about it.”
I love how you close your article. Like we’ve talked earlier about the challenge, right? Here’s what you wrote:
“So next time you see an article on life hackery or some list of actions you could be taking if you weren’t reading a list on taking actions, ask yourself why you’re searching externally for advice or shortcuts when you could be working on taking action in your own way, using your own brilliant mind to figure things out.”
Paul Jarvis: I like that. I don’t even like most of the stuff that I write, but actually I like the last two paragraphs in that article quite a bit.
Brian Gardner: I’ll talk about this on the show that I haven’t recorded yet, but in an inception kind of way, will be the show that precedes this one. In other words, I’m going to read through the whole article and throw in my editorializing — I don’t even know if that’s a word.
Paul Jarvis: Yeah, I think it is. It is now.
Brian Gardner: Yeah, it’s abstract. We’re creatives. Of course it’s a word. I’m going to give my audience the thoughts as I read through it because I agree with so much of it. I’m convicted more than anything on so much of it. I actually look forward to recording that, but those two final paragraphs were definitely homerun hitters and a positive way to encourage people to basically thinking about productivity.
Like you said earlier, there’s a fine line, and it looks different for each person. Maybe some people need a little bit more consumption of said material before they’re ready to launch. Others, like me, probably don’t need much because there’s really just a fear thing that blocks me from stop trying to be productive and just go do it. They say “just ship it,” right? That’s the key phrase.
Being Afraid of Everything as a Creative Person
Paul Jarvis: Yeah. A lot of it is self-reflecting a little bit and analyzing that. If it’s just fear that’s holding you back, then you’ve got a problem because, a lot of times, I’m afraid of everything. I just am. But if I look at the things that I’ve done and done well with, I’ve been afraid of them, but I’ve still taken action on them — which looks a lot different than, “I want to launch this, but I don’t know how yet,” and then learning enough to be able to launch it.
When it’s just fear, then it’s like, “Really, Paul, what’s the worst that’s going to happen here? You’re not going to die some horrible, embarrassing death if you launch this thing. You’re just going to launch it. If some people don’t like it, they wouldn’t like anything that you launched anyways.”
So I think a lot of times it just comes down to, with this and with everything, a little self-reflection on the motivation. Not even the motivation, but what’s keeping you from being motivated to act?
Brian Gardner: That’s a good question to internalize. I know for me, 99 percent of the time, it’s fear. It’s not a lack of knowledge. It’s not a lack of access to resources or the ability to execute. It just straight up is, “I can do this. I know I can. I’m capable of it. I’ve proven that I can, but every time I go to ship something” — whether it’s a piece of writing, whether it’s a design — often times now it’s trying to edit and record the podcast show. It’s just a matter of pushing the button.
How We Use Teasers to Gauge the Safety in Shipping
Brian Gardner: I’ll quote her probably on every episode here, Ruthie Lindsey talks about the whole authenticity and fear of rejection and the things that we think people will feel about us end up usually being the opposite. As creatives, here we are thinking, “Everyone’s going to hate this,” and sometimes we’ll do things that are sort of safe — like throw up a teaser on Dribble — just to gauge what the audience might respond with.
Sometimes that’s all it takes. I’ll throw something up on Dribbble or in a Facebook group, and people will say, “Oh, I love that!” That’s maybe all I need to just say, “OK good, there’s probably going to be a positive response here.” The fear subsides. Then it’s just a matter of executing and getting it out the door.
Paul Jarvis: Yeah. I also find, especially with my writing, the things that I’m the most afraid of hitting publish on, are the things that resonate the most with my audience. I schedule my newsletter and my blog posts a week or two in advance because, if I had to just hit send, I would be too scared. I would chicken out every single time.
But if I schedule them for a week or two in advance, it’s like, “Oh that’s in the future. You’re not going to worry about that, Paul. It’s coming up, who cares?” I schedule it, and then it publishes on schedule. Then I forgot that it was going to publish on schedule, and then it does. I have little things in my brain that help me get over and act on the fears that I have because I’m the same — I’m afraid of doing all these things.
Responding to Hate Mail and Other Criticisms
Paul Jarvis: I’m afraid of all of the rejection. I get hate mail every day. It’s just weird. I don’t even understand why. That doesn’t stop me from doing the things, and these aren’t people that were really going to buy anything anyways. I don’t really get hate mail from people who have bought a book or bought a course.
They’re just people that have their own stuff going on and their criticism is more of a reflection on them than it is of anything that I’ve made or haven’t made anyways. It’s hard to deal with, yes, but it’s also — pretty much every time — more about that person than you even if you are getting criticized on the Internet because it happens.
Brian Gardner: They say when you get hate mail or when you get haters, that means you’ve arrived. I don’t get a ton, primarily because I don’t think I put myself out there enough to warrant, not even to warrant it, but because I play so safe. This is the one thing I wish I could totally change about myself.
As No Sidebar evolves into more of a creative movement for those who are in the space and to be authentic in our ways, I really hope to push that a little bit more and be a little bit more bold in the way that you have with a lot of your writing.
Speaking of the hate, just in general, let’s talk specifically about the article. I’m guessing there’s some productivity activists that may have responded. Have you gotten any negative response to that article that we’re talking about here?
Paul Jarvis: Not specifically about the article. I’m friends with some people whose job it is to teach productivity to people, and they laughed at this article because it’s fine. They understand this. The reason that they teach productivity is not the reasons that I’m talking about in the article anyways, so I think it’s fine.
The other week I talked about inspiration and motivation and how seeing 50,000 inspiring quotes over Unsplash photos on Instagram isn’t really that inspiring to me. I know a lot of my readers do that, so I got a bit of negativity from that.
I guess there are two kinds of criticism that I get. There’s the dissension, which is fine. I sent this out and somebody replied and disagreed with it. It was a totally fine email. She was very respectful, and it was just like, “I don’t agree with that,” and I’m like, “Good on you. I’m glad you don’t agree. You’re thinking. You’ve taken action on exactly the thing I wanted you to take action.”
Then, sometimes, it’s just like, “Your writing sucks.” I don’t even need to engage in that. The week before this one, somebody sent me a nasty email. Here’s a pro tip. If they reply to your newsletter, you can scroll down and click your own unsubscribe button — it takes them off the list. I did that for this person, and then they emailed me every single day asking why I didn’t reply to their first nasty email.
For things like that, you have something going on. “Please go deal with your own stuff, dude. I cannot help you in any way whatsoever.” He had a problem with one of the articles that I wrote, and I was like, “That’s fine. This isn’t Paul’s word is the only word. This is some opinion that some guy on the Internet has. It’s OK if you disagree.”” I disagree with lots of stuff I read. It’s fine.
Brian Gardner: It’s one thing to disagree. Like the first person you talked about, say, “Hey, let’s just talk about our opinions and do it in a nice way.” When you’re a douchebag and you write something like that, you have to just roll those off.
Derek Halpern is a great example of a guy who, I’m sure, gets hate mail all the time. Not because he’s a bad guy, but because he’s so flamboyant and so convicting in all of his thoughts. Probably to his own admission, he’s so over-the-top. I love him, and I love what he does.
OK fine, someone writes, “It sucks,” or “I have your writing or your design.” That’s great. Like you said, clearly — and I’m a total believer when people usually are nasty like that — it’s totally their own baggage they’re dealing with.
Often times — and I have mentioned this in the show a few weeks ago — when you’re envious or when you trash people, there’s usually a degree of that envy there. In other words, I’m going to knock someone down because I’m jealous of what they’ve done. It makes me feel better to say, “Well Paul, your article on productivity was totally lame, and I don’t buy it. It’s garbage.”
It really means, “Hey, it struck a nerve. It called me out on something in my own head that I know I’m struggling with.” Instead of saying, “Hey, thanks for challenging me,” the baggage just gets in the way and makes you come off like a tool.
Paul Jarvis: To some degree, they’re kind of acting on my intended action. They’re just not really internalizing it and thinking about it. It’s striking a chord. They’re just lashing out instead of, “Why do I want to lash out? Maybe I should think about that just a tiny bit.”
Brian Gardner: Maybe they’re reacting rather than taking action — which I think are two totally different things.
Paul Jarvis: Yes! Agreed. That’s a great way of putting it.
Brian Gardner: Maybe in the coming weeks as I focus No Sidebar more on to creative entrepreneurs rather than where it’s at now — which is just design a simple life. I don’t even know if it’s definable. I haven’t been able to really pin that down, but hate in creativity would be a great thing to talk about even further. Not just a few minutes like we talked about here.
So I might be pinging you in a few weeks and say, “Hey, let’s just hop on and riff about being hated by people and what that means.” The reality of No Sidebar is what gets in the way of succeeding from a creative standpoint. Hate and negativity really could be a huge, huge, huge detriment to a creative person’s success.
Paul Jarvis: Yeah. I know a lot of people where that’s held them back or that’s kept them from launching product two after they launch product one. A thousand people loved it and one person hated it, and then that’s enough for some people. It’s horrible that that happens.
It’s so difficult to deal with because we live in an age where everybody can criticize everything without recourse or repercussion. It doesn’t take anything to Tweet something to somebody like, “Your product was crap.” It takes two seconds. You don’t even need to think about it again, but you’ve just affected that person in some way maybe.
Brian Gardner: That’s good stuff. Part of No Sidebar is keeping the show to about 30 minutes because I don’t want to be not No Sidebar.
I’m going to cut us off like I always seem to do on the shows. I’m just going to cut it off right here and say, first of all, thank you so very much for, within a couple days, hopping on Skype and doing the call to talk about it.
I will link to the article as well as a few other things that you do that are great in the show notes just so that people can see all of the stuff that you do and are capable of doing in hopes that your freelance future holds many, many great projects to work on.
Again, thank you for being on the show. Thank you for having the courage to write the things that you do and the way that you do them. For me, and I’m sure hundreds and possibly thousands of other people, it helps them take action. I look forward to talking to you again.
Until we talk again, have a great probably couple of weeks, and I hope that we can talk about the hate thing.
Paul Jarvis: Thanks, Brian. I had a good time talking to you today.
Brian Gardner: There you have it, friends. Paul Jarvis “on being digital hoarders. “Go ahead and take a look at what Paul has to say over at pjrvs.com.
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Until next week, this has been Brian Gardner.